elster PR6 water meter replaced after 4 years (battery dead) and no pulse readings anymore

Flukso FLM02 250 with following 3 phase readings (1-2-3) lost readings of water meter some weeks ago.
Imbedded battery was dead after 4 years of service (as indicated by vendor).
I ordered a new one in the UK with a battery life (guaranteed!) of 7 years. No readings.
Checked the 25 meter connection (pair) cable ==> OK (measuring 9V left side = 9V right side.
Checked + - <==> - + (yellow/black, CH1P/GRND) <==> black/yellow (GRND/YELLOW) ==> no readings.
I mean I inverted the pair to check if + - is connected on the right sub port.
I used yellow and black (ground). Is this correct?
Checked log and tx buffer ==> xxxxxxx3925 (phase 1) logged and OK (2 and 3 are part of one 3 phase group
Checked log and tx buffer ==> xxxxxxx3aa6 (port 4) NOT logged and NOK while water is flowing and pair cable
Checked log and tx buffer ==> xxxxxxx3eed (port 5) NOT logged and NOK while water is flowing and pair cable
I have only one water meter connected to port 5 + -.; 4 + - is a "spare" port.
I saved the sensors several times with enable disable.

Can't see any issue on the log/mptx.
I browsed the forum several times. Can't find anything.
Did I miss a setting? What should I do with the available 32 hex sensor ids (xxxxxxxx3ee8)? disable or delete them?
Flukso FLM is 8 years old, new Elster PR6 is a few days.
Any help appreciated

Marc Verbeke

B-Man's picture

Tried a different cable?
Or use port 4?

mvrvma's picture

The Elster device cable has 6 small wires:
black GND , red CH2P, yellow CH1P, white CH1D, green CH2C, brown TAMP
Current pairt ==> black GND + yellow CH1P
Pair with old sensor was (maybe) ==> black GND + red CH2P (can't remember it)
If black + yellow isn't the right connection than pulse will not flow to port 5+ - at all.

gebhardm's picture

Don‘t think, get the specification and check there. Google is your friend. Even if devices look the same, they aren‘t after four years...

mvrvma's picture

black GND + yellow CH1P is the right connection for a Elster PR6. (manual found in Google)

GND is +++, yellow CH1Pulse is minus.
Still no pulse visible on the log.

I'm wondering if the brand new device has a good working Li-battery.
Normally it generates a pulse without externel source due to the Li-battery.
But the imbedded battery + components are "burried" in the device itself to protect it from water damage.

gebhardm's picture

Output is just a „switch“; the battery is for the detector which is more than a reed... see open-collector. So with an Ohmmeter you can check to see pulses.

gebhardm's picture

And Gnd is minus

mvrvma's picture

Elster PR6 V200: transistor switch is used. Connection -----GND and +++++yellow / red. CH1P or CH2P
Outputs are all “open drain”. This means a electronic switch transistor is used, it opens and closes just like a reed switch does. But it doesn't send a Flukso port 4 or 5.

Designed with advanced bi-directional inductive technology helping to enhance the efficiency of network system management, leakage control and reading of water meters remotely.
The inductive pulse modules have two outputs, offering both high and low speed bi-directional pulse capabilities as standard. They are compatible with most Building Management Systems (BMS), Data Loggers, Remote Readers and AMR systems.

Yellow (CH1P) White (CH1D) Red (CH2P) Green (CH2C) Brown (TAMP) Black (GND)
Primary Pulse Channel 1 Output Directional Flag Secondary Pulses Channel 2 Output Compensation Flag Tamper Common
Outputs all pulses regardless of direction
Gives the direction of the pulses on CH1P The signal is High for Forward Flow and Low for Reverse Flow
Outputs pulses that are compensated for backwards flow. The module counts the backwards flow and stops outputting until the same forward flow has occurred
Indicates when compensation is occurring by going to Low state during backflow compensation
Activates to High state when the PR6/7 is removed from the meter or low battery
Ground --- must be used for 0V as you said.

gebhardm's picture

My question was, do you see pulses when you connect an Ohmmeter? The spec says "active low", that is, it switches towards GND (so Yellow to Black); the "high" comes from the FLM itself, as the input is pulled up internally.
When you connect an Ohmmeter to the yellow/black you should see infinite resistance, dropping to (near) zero on a pulse, so when water is running. Is the impulse module correctly mounted on top of the liter wheel?

mvrvma's picture

I understood your question.
Measuring resistance in Ohm between GND minus and YELLOW +++ gives "1" during hours.
I took the 2 m cable directly from the Elster device. Is the battery of a new device faulty?
I went to the nearby watersoftener (CaCO3 + NaCl ==> CaCl2 + NaHCO3, you know) and this device was running in cycle mode. Not normal.
A small stream of water went in and out maybe for days...... I don't know what the results would be (on the Elster) of a never ending (since days) small stream of water.
1) stopped the small flow of water by putting the watersoftener in BYPASS
2) tightened the Elster as much as possible to the real water meter (V200?)/ I can’t turn the screws (clockwise) anymore! Could break the glass.
3) Used the 2 meter cable directly from the Elster instead of a 20 m extension cable pair.
4) Connected the Ohm meter to GND and YELLOW - and +. ==> Always 1. Shit.
5) Connected the 20 + 2 meter to port 5 - + of the Flukso. Clicked on Electricity ==> still OK, Clicked on water ==> no diagram on hour, days, months, but one on “year”.
6) Logout and click on water again + click on hours/days,… Graph seems correct. Even the very small amount of water flow is now visible as 0.02 liter per min.?

What is the conclusion? What else can I measure?
Why do I need to logout to see the water graph? I need to login to see the electricity graph.
Am I in another FLM? (share).

So we are moving from electrical issues to Flukso graph zone definitions. Strange?
Are you still interested? I am!

Marc Verbeke

mvrvma's picture

It is working again. See MVRVMA | FRI, 29/03/2019 - 14:16